Beemer's cycle - comments please

gorilla wrote:

beemer wrote:
Test shuts down your hormones to produce test. My understanding is that HCG kick starts the test production process again. By using it during cycle, are you not confusing your hormones as it does not know whether it produce or not produce, thereby causing futher damage? :blush:

No, the exogenous test causes shutdown via negative feedback of the HPTA. hcg mimics LH. LH directly stimulates testosterone release - so there will be not shutdown. This is what I understand of the topic - correct me if im wrong MA,DJ,Koe007,admin,pump,chapel :whistle: , eidolon :whistle:

lol! You guys still awesome

Well there wont be shutdown in terms of testicular function, but your pituaitary glad will have stopped producing boh LH and FSH and you will stick need to kickstart natural LH prudction by the pituiatry gland. Hence the introduction of SERMS such as clomid and nolvadex.

beemer wrote:

iMan wrote: Beemer what diet will you be following?

I really don't know. :blush:

I usually consume about 2500 calories (40% prot, 40 carbs, 20% fat) but gains became stagnant on previous cycle so DJ advised I should double carbs on training days. I understand that Anavar is more of a cutting agent than winny, so I'm assuming that with 2500 calories (with double carbs on training days) I'm hoping to make some nice learn gains. If fat levels don't drop, I hoping that an increase in Anavar dosage will assist.

Not sure if this makes sense :blush:

ok post the one you will be following exactly please

To be completely honest I would do 600mg test e, tbol frontload, winstrol bridge.

Muscle is the ultimate fatburnr bro nd I suggest you add some more size - you cn do that easily. f your diets solid you can lean out leke when bridging.

I suggest you start on 300-350g protein per day an about 150g carbs - the rest fats.

After 2-3 weeks up carbs 250g per day.

After 2-3 weeks up carbs and protein: Protein to about 350g and carb to 300-350g.

Then after another 2-3 weeks up carbs to 400-450g.

Assess ur bloatig with the car though.

Then when you start bridging start cycling carbs, low,low,low,medium,zero,high,low,medium and repeat.
Also add in cardio 1hour per day when bridging and 1 hour per week on cycle for the metabolism.

id also do the cycle that Gorilla sugested. 600mg test e with a winny bridge. you need to add some mass to your frame.
regarding the diet you are going to have to play it by ear, im sure Gorilla is just giving guidelines. im in week 10 of my cycle and im still just a little over 200 carbs a day. im very carb sensitive and that causes me to pick up fat rather easily. so i have to watch my carbs closely

then you get dudes like Pyro and Gorilla that eats 500grams of oats a day and still look shredded

INCUBUS wrote:

manery wrote: No offence but your quite light.. how tall are you? how much did you weigh before your first cycle ?

Why is it that everyone has to weigh 90kg before they can start juicing. There are lots of guys myself included that have no desire to be huge.
I know a lot of you guys dont believe in the " hard gainer " type of person but it does exists.
Not everyone has the frame to carry huge weight. I am 34 and have been gyming for 4 years properly and with a decent diet for the last 2 years my weight gain was extreemly slow and i got to a point where i almost said fuckit and just did my cardio base sports and dropped the weight training all together.
Thats when i turned to juice I now have huge motivation because of the results i can achieve but even still my results are not as good as what alot of you guys " no hard gainers " are probably achieving.

I am not trying to make excuses for lazy 18 year old kids full of there own natural test. They need to get educated train and eat hard and only look at juice when they much older.

The point i am trying to make is that genitics plays a massive role in muscle development and the persons goals are also an important thing to remember before you tell the oke he is too light weight to start juicing.

Ok had my ramble, manery this isint really directed at you but just a general comment I wanted to make.

Bud i never said he had to be 90, i understand what your saying but 74kgs at 16 % bodyfat is very mediocre for someone whose already done his first cycle no matter what the goal. (Beemer not trying to offend you bud just trying to get my point across)

I understand everyone has there own goals sorry if came across like abit of poes.

dont let it stress you mate. we all entitled to our opinions on this forum. if someone doesnt like it, then too bad. im sure everyone knows you werent trying to be a doos. i actually side with you on this matter. 74kgs is quite small for someone with a cycle under their belt. but its beemers body and ultimately his decision as to what he wants to do with it.

im also not trying to offend you in anyway beemer but i have to have Manerys back on this one because i know where he is coming from

MRfeathers wrote: id also do the cycle that Gorilla sugested. 600mg test e with a winny bridge. you need to add some mass to your frame.
regarding the diet you are going to have to play it by ear, im sure Gorilla is just giving guidelines. im in week 10 of my cycle and im still just a little over 200 carbs a day. im very carb sensitive and that causes me to pick up fat rather easily. so i have to watch my carbs closely

then you get dudes like Pyro and Gorilla that eats 500grams of oats a day and still look shredded

Exacly! Its a good simple cycle youve planned, but its not for you imo.

If you gain 4kgs fat thats fine bro, its all about the mass hey..You need some mass.otherwis just do clen and yohime and youshould look very decent

Yip some people like bulking really hard and then cutting really hard. They way u want to do it is up to you. As long as you're in a caloric surpluss and getting your protein in you will grow

gorilla wrote: To be completely honest I would do 600mg test e, tbol frontload, winstrol bridge.

Muscle is the ultimate fatburnr bro nd I suggest you add some more size - you cn do that easily. f your diets solid you can lean out leke when bridging.

I suggest you start on 300-350g protein per day an about 150g carbs - the rest fats.

After 2-3 weeks up carbs 250g per day.

After 2-3 weeks up carbs and protein: Protein to about 350g and carb to 300-350g.

Then after another 2-3 weeks up carbs to 400-450g.

Assess ur bloatig with the car though.

Then when you start bridging start cycling carbs, low,low,low,medium,zero,high,low,medium and repeat.
Also add in cardio 1hour per day when bridging and 1 hour per week on cycle for the metabolism.

good avice gorilla, just one more thing to add. ive come to found that nutrient timing to be as critical to a diet as overall calorie intake. Carbs should be limited to three meals, with two being pre and post workout. I have found that consuming 50% of overall carbs post workout and 25% each on the other two meals. Last meals of the day, given that you training in the morning, should ideally be comprised of fats, protein and veggies.

Therefore, if you train at say 08:00 in the morning. You will eat 1/6 of total protein intake and 1/4 of overall carb intake pre-workout

post workout meal = 1/2 total carb intake and 1/6 protein intake

Next meal, hour of post workout meal, = 1/4 total carb intake and 1/6 protein intake

remaining three meals = 1/6 total protein intake and 1/3 fats along with 1 cup of green veggies per meal

Yes I agree with gsp, if you gain too much fat then go to 3 meals a day with carbs bfast,prewo,poswo.

If your still having problem then lower carb intake. Fat s ugly, but if its gonna take fat to grow then dont stres it. You need dem carbs to grow!!

If you are really worried then do like 100g carbs on non trainig days.

You can even try ALA,chromium,vandyl sulphae and cinnamon to tolerate carbs better.

Bud , i honestly think your gonna fine, im helping a buddy with his cycle and he is looking sharp bro, he is about 15% bodyfat at the moment all love handles and abs... His armsre veiny chest is much thicker and he is looking very thick if you gemy drift. Now this guy gets fat reall quick!! I started low carbs, then every few weeks increased and changed it up. He trains at about 3 so his last carb meal is around 7.But he even has mil in his shake at night for extra calories - He not getting at at all... But that him not you...


Ramble over goodluck!

I hear and truly appreciate everyone's comments. In response,

- I've done a dbol/cyp/winny cycle in this year and wanted to give my liver a break, hence no tbol.

- what's difference between gaining fat/water and leaning out during the bridge vs what I'm doing. Surely the net result is the same - lean mass, just going about it differently?

- I probably have a tummy phobia but want to look good for summer (never had that lean solid look before), and with the intention of consuming excess calories, surely I gain some quality lean mass (bringing me closer to the 80kg target)?

- the aim was to lean out for summer in preparation for a decent bulking cycle in next year, as you guys always suggest a low body fat% when running a bulking cycle

So, the big question, am I wasting my money?

beemer wrote: I hear and truly appreciate everyone's comments. In response,

- I've done a dbol/cyp/winny cycle in this year and wanted to give my liver a break, hence no tbol.

- what's difference between gaining fat/water and leaning out during the bridge vs what I'm doing. Surely the net result is the same - lean mass, just going about it differently?

- I probably have a tummy phobia but want to look good for summer (never had that lean solid look before), and with the intention of consuming excess calories, surely I gain some quality lean mass (bringing me closer to the 80kg target)?

- the aim was to lean out for summer in preparation for a decent bulking cycle in next year, as you guys always suggest a low body fat% when running a bulking cycle

So, the big question, am I wasting my money?

The question is that you are looking to run a cycle without knowing exactly what you want to achcieve. You seem to attribute a specific look to a specific weight which is a flawed approach in my opinion. You need to decide whether u want to drop some bodyfat and then start a cycle when you leaner or look at bulking up now and then cutting post cycle. Body recomp can be done (where one seeks to gain lbm and drop fat at the same time) but its extremely difficult and is usually achieved with someone who has a nuanced understanding of dieting, aas usage and, most important of all, their bodies.

Wat your goal?

gorilla wrote: Wat your goal?

lean mass

The test is for mass. The lean part is your diet

Well then bro fuck that prop and var story- thats more of a cutter.

Test,tbol/superdrol(eish),winny+proviron bridge.

Get a good diet.

End of story.

I need the quick clearance times of the Prop, which doesn't allow me to bridge with the winny and I also only have 11 weeks to run the cycle which should include bridge, excl PCT.

I've come across MK's and Snitch's cycles, and have come up with the following 2 options:

Week 1-8: Test Prop EOD
Week 1-8: Tbol
Week 1-10:Proviron

OR

Week 1-8: Test Prop EOD
Week 1-6: Tbol
Week 7-10: Anavar
Week 1-10:Proviron

Week 11: Clomid
Week 12-15: Nolva
hCG throughout the bridge, or perhaps earlier

How is the liver toxicity of the tbol compared to the dbol?

Tbol will be better for your goals mate. I would do the prop 1.5ml EOD, 40mg tbol daily, maybe 60mg since your running it 10 weeks keep the dose low...10 weeks cos you might as welll bridge with it.

Run hcg 2-3 times per week @500iu's per shot.
Run Essentiale/liv-52 or that new one from admin throughout.


So this would be your cycle:

Week 1-10:
* Tbol 40mg-60mg ED
* Proviron 40-50mg ED
* Hcg 2-3 times a week 500iu's per shot
Week 1-8:
* Test prop 150mg EOD

Week 11: START PCT
* Day 1-7 - Clomid 100mg ED
* Day 8-38 - Nolvadex 20mg ED

Thanks. Sounds good. Might work out cheaper as Anavar is abit pricey. I'll be monitoring diet closely as I want quality gains.

Are tbol gains the same as dbol excluding the water?

Should I be concerned for my liver as I've come off a dbol cycle mid May? :blush:

gorilla wrote: Tbol will be better for your goals mate. I would do the prop 1.5ml EOD, 40mg tbol daily, maybe 60mg since your running it 10 weeks keep the dose low...10 weeks cos you might as welll bridge with it.

Run hcg 2-3 times per week @500iu's per shot.
Run Essentiale/liv-52 or that new one from admin throughout.


So this would be your cycle:

Week 1-10:
* Tbol 40mg-60mg ED
* Proviron 40-50mg ED
* Hcg 2-3 times a week 500iu's per shot
Week 1-8:
* Test prop 150mg EOD

Week 11: START PCT
* Day 1-7 - Clomid 100mg ED
* Day 8-38 - Nolvadex 20mg ED

Agree with everything except the HCG dosage. This is not a highly suppressive cycle so 250iu twice or three times a week should suffice. 1500iu/week for 10 weeks increases porbability of gyno sides significantly.

I'm having a blond moment here. Is that 150mg prop the same as 1mil?