Training Programmes

Evening gents,

So i have always stuck to my own style of training and have used a max-ot a lot as my core base. Thrown in 5x5 and even german volume training to mix things up on the odd occasion.

So recently i decided to vary my outlook and tried a few other things that gave me great results, tri's just exploded after a 4 week shock therapy i experimented with for example. So now i want to try a few more things and have been doing some more in depth looking at FST-7 and Dorain Yates' style of training, and want to decide which one to do.

I am leaning to Yates, don't know why, just think my body would like it. But would still like some opinions and personal experience on the two.. FST-7 does appeal though because i have a very weak upper chest..

So anyone wanna add? Who has tried either or? did you like them/get results etc..

It is easy to overtrain on fst-7, and you cant do the 7 set thing for everything.
it just gets too much. I also lean toward dorians school of thought...

but what if you do dorians style training with a fst-7 set for your chest?

what did you do for your triceps?

yes i have also worried about the over training on it.. Not a bad idea on the combination for my chest.

I did them three times a week, mondays, wednesdays and thursdays. Did 1-2 exercises 3-5 sets each day, different exercise each time. On Monday i just did push downs, wednesdays kick backs and skull crushers and close grip bench on fridays. Worked very nicely.

FST-7 Was a great program for me, but as said, after a while you have a tendency to overtrain, and some workouts are hard to keep under an hour (legs always took very long). Also, me never having done a cycle ever, I reckon FST-7 with its high volume training is not exactly suited for someone not on gear.

Then again, if you are on gear, I'm guessing overtraining doesn't set in as easily (this is based on a guess, also on what I read about a bb doing a cycle) but you guys might have more experience on that matter than me.

Regarding the Yates program, I started doing it about 3 months ago, and I feel my chest size has increased, really a fan of the minimal sets, yet destroying the muscle, school of thought. Be warned though, on this program a training partner is almost certainly required, as taking sets beyond failure on bench press, etc. is obviously not advisable when done on your own. Also, after the first week or so, if done correctly, you WILL be sore! I remember feeling I had been doing the same routine too long on FST-7, I came across the video of Yates's blood and guts program on bodybuilding.com, it looked fun and made sense, so I mentioned it to my gym partner and we started doing it. Lots of pain, but lots of fun!

Lol, you guys make it too complicated. :huh:

I normally train tricpes differently than other bodyparts. 4 sets of pulldowns (probably 30reps) lol I explode. At 14 I can't anymore. Then I just think "those hot girls are looking at you" and push myself. Works great! Followed with tricep extentions laying down on a bench followed with skull crushers. (Kak heavy with the 100pound dumbells around 4 reps) the next day I usually can't even take my afternoon nap because I wake up in pain if I bend my arms think those pulldowns do the most damage.

keen, been watching blood and guts today in between study sessions. The guy makes sense, guess after 6 olympia wins under that training regime its gotta be a winner. Just hope i respond well to it and can get a regular training partner.

na jakes normally i go heavy for low reps no bull shit just lift and go. Its only recently i have started complicating things, and it works very well

If it works for you, why not. I don't follow a training program. If I walk into the gym and feel like doing chest that day, I do chest. Nice and heavy, good technique, compound movements will always yield results.

Was doing rope crunches the other day, people looked at me as if I was a retard. But boy, it worked my abs that's about the weirdist thing I do in the gym haha

CHAPEL wrote: keen, been watching blood and guts today in between study sessions. The guy makes sense, guess after 6 olympia wins under that training regime its gotta be a winner. Just hope i respond well to it and can get a regular training partner.

That is why dorian remains the ultimate mr olympia of all time (for me) as I understand, he did all his shit by himself... diet,training and chems... its people like this that really push the industy forward.

shit you are a special case hey haha, you do everything differently.. Well respect where its due, with those stats its seemed to have seriously paid off.

ya TB i completely agree with you, the guy really was a massive pioneer for the sport.

I also somehow think that training like dorian did is optimal, most people cannot train with that intensity or still use good for under all that weight. or really go to failure, as they stop as soon as it comes to the important part of the set.

ya, if you focus on a set properly you really start to feel how hard it is as opposed to just banging out lots of sets and reps.. I like that about the programme. Only thing i am a little confused about is that it is a six week programme.. and after that..? Switch to something else then go back..? That would be my inclination but not sure..

Training plays a much smaller role than your diet, and the gear you run. But you already know that. Lol, it keeps my body guessing haha I don't even know what ill do on a given day nevermind my body. Lol I sometimes do the weirdest training spits. The exercises I do stay pretty constant tho. Just the splits I mix up. Leg training sessions are the most intense. Lol sometimes I literally can't stand. So nice to puke up the oats I ate before my leg session after. Heavy deds and squats make me puke

Sounds like Antoine Vailant, he trains "instinctively" his only set workouts are his back ones and he is a beast.. Literally decides what exercises to do when he walks into the gym. His body part days are kept the same though i think.. I cant do heavy deads at the moment, i keep tearing my shins open and leaving blood all over the bar, have massive scabs now.. sies.. need to get some shin pads haha..

Think i am going to give Yates' style a shot, will just wait to see how Theodoric ran it after 6 weeks..

I only do heavy deads once every two weeks, because I fuck up my back so badly with deads that I can't do squats then(for the rest of the week). Lol.. Nothing wrong with my technique (I hope, think its pretty good). Ya get some shin pads! Haha that's nasty. Just wish I could add some thickness to my back. Kak wide but no thickness let us know how his training program works out for you

CHAPEL wrote: ya, if you focus on a set properly you really start to feel how hard it is as opposed to just banging out lots of sets and reps.. I like that about the programme. Only thing i am a little confused about is that it is a six week programme.. and after that..? Switch to something else then go back..? That would be my inclination but not sure..

well, perhaps you just do a two week cooldown (lower weight up the reps, about 50-60% of 6 cycle intensity) after every 6 week cycle and then for the next 6 week cycle you change the exercises and max out in those.

I have done DC training (DC was born from yates style training,but for this as well as dorian style you really need a training partner). an it works really well for naturals, you get seriously strong and big in a short while, but your joints take a knackering... thats why I would reccomend the deloading period. I really am a fan of these type of programmes.

when I did DC people thought I was on steroids,(thats how quick progress comes) I really love have duty style staining, and with your powerlifting background I guess you do too. but you will have to take care of your joints, otherwise you might run into some trouble. ( I got some serious golfers elbow from this)

Ill try upping the volume and see what happens. Just so freckn lazy when I am off cycle lol. Atleast my back will feel better if I switch to lighter deads haha

will either deload like you suggest or hit a tow week conventional 12-10-8 style programme so my muscles can get a little wake up.

Is that dog crap training? (i think that's the name) actually have a PDF on my pc somewhere on it. I am going to struggle with the training partner thing, my partner works late days and never really knows what his timings may be due to the nature of his job.. Will have to try and sort something out though for sure.

I do love heavy duty training, as long as the weight is heavy i am happy haha..

@jakes, i have never had back problems till recently where due to my shins i cant bring the barbell up close to my shins so my lower back is rounding.. by the time i get to legs 2 days later i can barely squat.. So i know what you mean.. Its not normally like that for me though, maybe get someone to film your form for you, lame i know, but it really does help..

the deload is neccesary in my opinion, your body needs it. shocking your muscles will come from changing the exercises for the next 6 weeks.yes DC is dog crap training.

I'm a massive fan of the Yates program so far, have actually been using his training principles for the past 3 months. I don't really stick to the 6 week thing, as it has been working for me, will only change it if I feel it needs changing. [EDIT] - To be fair, with holidays (still train, except I don't have a gym partner then), me getting sick, etc. it almost has been like me only doing the program for a few weeks on end each time

Just a quick note, Yates usually recommends cardio warmups before some of his training days. If you want to do this, it's entirely up to you

Before I post my workout, I must mention, I'm also a firm believer in modifying a workout to suit you. For example, if I ever did a working set and feel that I didn't completely exhaust the muscle, I'll do what me and my gym partner call "burn sets", for example after my chest routine, if I'm dissatisfied, I'll do anything, whether it be push ups until I literally can't anymore, or even cable flyes.

So far my workouts look like follows:

Day 1: Chest & Biceps

2 sets rotator cuff warmups (if you've watched the videos you'll know what this is)
Decline bench, 1 Warmup set, 10-12 reps, 1 medium set 10 reps, 1 working set 6 reps to failure
Incline DB press, 1 (medium) warmup set 8-10 reps, 1 working set 6 reps to failure
Flat DB flyes, 1 medium set 8-10 reps, 1 working set 6 reps to failure

DB concentration curls, 1 medium set 8-10 reps, 1 working set 6 reps to failure (this one burns like a mofo)
Barbell curls, 1 working set 6-10 reps (do this one properly)

Now, I'm not constantly going to type out the amount of reps I do, so just know from now on a "medium set" is usually 8-10 reps, while working sets you should aim for 6 reps, and if you can still do more, you do more, even if you can't, the idea is for the training partner to aid you with the lifting, it is only once your muscle can't resist the weight anymore when you've properly bombed it.

Day 2: Back (make sure you've eaten a lot throughout the day for this one, you'll need it for the end)

DB pullovers, 1 medium set, 1 working set
Close-grip lat pulldown, 1 medium set, 1 working set
DB rows, 1 medium set, 1 working set
Wide grip seated rows, 1 medium set, 1 working set
Deadlifts, 1 warmup set (I do it Stan Efferding style, only put about 25kgs on the sides, and do partial reps from the ground up, the part of the rep before you start extending your back) then I literally just pyramid the set, because I like deadlifts, but usually it's just 1 or 2 medium sets followed by a working set. Now this differs from Yates, because he suggests only lifting the weight from the ground once, and then only doing partial deads, but I'm not a fan of that.

Day 4: Shoulders & Tri's

DB Shoulder press, 1 moderate warmup, 1 medium, 1 working set
DB lateral raises, 1 medium, 1 working set
Cable side laterals, 1 medium, 1 working
DB rear laterals, 1 medium, 1 working
DB machine laterals (usually add this one because I struggle to always effectively isolate the rear delts using DB's)

For legs, unfortunately I do not follow Dorian's routine, as my training partner has a knee injury he got from rugby earlier this year, and it is still bugging him. But, I do recally bumping into a friend of mine at the gym once, and we both were doing legs that evening, so I challenged him to do the Yates program with me. I believe "never again" were his words afterwards! I must say, my legs were fried as well, but it was fun! Even the leg extension working set was pure torture, but I was smiling all the way (as the workout finished, I mean).

I know that was a long read, hopefully it helps a bit? As for the gains, well, I reckon if you're on gear then the gains made on this program will be quite great. I notice underneath your avatar you're saying you're cutting atm? Not sure how well this program will go with that though, as I've found that if I didn't eat enough, or even more than I'm used to, on the day of training, I just can't keep up with the intensity of the workout.

Good post, nice break down of the videos. I couldn't get my usual down loader to work so this is helpful. Thanks for the effort bud +1.. Ye the rotator exercises are a must, do those everyday anyway. Wont forget them haha..

I am bloody keen for that leg workout, it looked like pure death. Gonna hit my training partner with this in a few weeks because as you noticed i am cutting now.. So this may not be ideal for the moment.

In all seriousness will probably end up trying it later hahaha..

this video made me cringe..

EDIT: ffs it won't let me post link but youtube Dorian Yates and Chris Cormier directors cut..

CHAPEL wrote: this video made me cringe..

EDIT: ffs it won't let me post link but youtube Dorian Yates and Chris Cormier directors cut..

You mean the one where cormier goes into the parking lot to puke after a working set of hack squats?

This program, when done properly, definitely no joke

EDIT:

that one indeed.. Insane..