PWO Shake on OFF days

The second best time to take nutrients in, is first thing in the morning after the over night fast.

What are your thoughts about taking a PWO shake first thing in the morning to spike insulin and trigger anabolism.

Do you think it's a good idea or will it just make you fat?

That is what I used to do before I would make breakfast but only when I try to add calories into my day - I think its a time peroid similar to after gym.
Makes sense to me but im no expert.

PS are you bigDave from ME?

it will make you fat, why on earth would yopu want to triiger an insulin spike first thing in the morning? PWO is what it is a POST workout shake...they are full of sugars hence the insulin spike. HIGH GI is reserved for post weights workout...any other time, fat fat fat...

Rather use a pure protein shake if you dont have the time to make some eggs:)

I dont think Big Dave Cooks from ME would be asking this kind of question:)

Saizen wrote:

it will make you fat, why on earth would yopu want to triiger an insulin spike first thing in the morning? PWO is what it is a POST workout shake...they are full of sugars hence the insulin spike. HIGH GI is reserved for post weights workout...any other time, fat fat fat...

First thing in the morning glycogen levels will be depleted and insulin sensitivity will be high (similar to post workout). So a PWO shake first thing in the morning will store nutrients the same way taking one immediately after training will do.

Cortisol levels are be at their highest in the morning and insulin antagonises cortisol. So an insulin spike will turn off catabolism.

I would rather see to it that my bed-time shake got some Casein/peanut butter in it.

Allthough glycogen levels will be lower you cant compare it to PWO? I would also opt for a higher protein shake, suppose you can add some dextrose if you feel like it to spike levels.

LSJ wrote:

I would rather see to it that my bed-time shake got some Casein/peanut butter in it.

Peanut butter or any fat before bed is a bad idea. It will blunt the sleep induced growth hormone release. Best to have pure protein before bed, no carbs or fat.

BigDave wrote:

LSJ wrote:

I would rather see to it that my bed-time shake got some Casein/peanut butter in it.

Peanut butter or any fat before bed is a bad idea. It will blunt the sleep induced growth hormone release. Best to have pure protein before bed, no carbs or fat.

i dont believe that is true,it slows down the digestion of proteins and if what u are saying about fats blunting growth hormone during sleep was true why is it that growth hormone levels are constantly elevated during a ketogenic diet? a mix of protein and fats is good for you as it will slow down the digestion of the proteins and will keep u fuller for longer and keep the digestion of proteins happening through out the night slowing the release of protein into your blood,also the added fats take longer to digest making it more beneficial to your metabolism as your body uses more energy to break fats down.where are the studies that tell u fats blunt-en GH release?

DJ wrote:

i dont believe that is true...where are the studies that tell u fats blunt-en GH release?

It's common knowledge, but since you asked here you go :

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC292406/

You should also read this article it will help you understand what causes GH release/inhibition :

www.johnberardi.com/articles/hormones/gh.htm

If you want to slow the absorbtion of a protein shake before bed, it would be better to mix in some fibre.

i will give that a read tomorrow as i dont have time right now,but thanks.... its quite weird cos everything i have read has said that eating fats before bed is a good idea as somefats increase gh secretion...fiber slows down digestion but ummm it tastes like sand and not many people are gonna have a bowl of veg before bed,but a tablespoon of oil wont kill...

i dont want to hijack the thread but have a few Qs regarding this.

1) if you shouldnt take something that spikes the insulin on your off days, with what should you take your creatine on off days for max obsorbtion?

2) i found the following in a book called GEAR MONSTER.

"DO NOT EAT ANY SUGARS OR SIMPLE CARBS WITHIN AN HOUR OF WORKING OUT!!!
If you do, your pancreas will release insulin to break it down, the insulin tells the ATP to stop converting to ADP releasing energy, and if you work out, you won't get as effective training and results. When ATP converts to ADP, a phosphate molecule is released providing energy to flex your muscle - this happens millions of times at once when flexing. Then the phosphate molecules reattach to ADP to form ATP again. Insulin counteracts that.
DO EAT SUGARS AND SIMPLE CARBS IMMEDIATELY AFTER WORKING OUT!!!This will release the insulin, stop the ATP ADP cycle, and allow your body to get energy from the sugars rather than from burning protein (which is needed to
rebuild muscle). Also, you want to replace your glycogen stores for your next day's workout. Add L-Glutamine to your Gatorade or Cranberry Juice to help aid in muscle recovery."

in contradiction to this i also see many guys (incl dj etc) saying to take something like dextrose before a workout? so which is best before workout? carbs or no carbs?

well he is umm saying dont take simple carbs but then he tells u to drink gatorade and cranberry juice which does exactly the same thing except the cranberry juice is less effective...

thanks dj but that's post workout so in that area he agrees with taking a lot of simple carbs. i am just wondering why he states not to take any carbs before a workout because the reasoning sounds pretty legit so i just want to know if its better to take carbs or not to take carbs preworkout?

Frikkie wrote:

thanks dj but that's post workout so in that area he agrees with taking a lot of simple carbs. i am just wondering why he states not to take any carbs before a workout because the reasoning sounds pretty legit so i just want to know if its better to take carbs or not to take carbs preworkout?

You do need some sort of carbo loading pre workout. How else will you fuel your workout? It's like trying to run your car on an empty tank.

bro of course u need carbs pre work out,unless u are on a keto diet,carbs fuel your body and your work outs,why wouldnt u want to fuel the body during a work out?have low and moderate gi carbs pre work out and then simples post work out.

oh ok thanks a lot guys!

North_Boy1 wrote:

You do need some sort of carbo loading pre workout. How else will you fuel your workout? It's like trying to run your car on an empty tank.

Here we go again... you have a TWO DAY supply of glucose stored in your liver (glycogen). More than enough to fuel your weight training session. Eating carbs (within 2hrs) before your session will blunt the endogenous growth hormone release brought on by training.

It's like trying to run your car with an empty tank, but you forget you have a massive reserve tank on board (liver glycogen).