Early Morning Training & Carb intake

Would like some input from you guys on this....

I train weights early in the morning (step into Gym & 4:50) to about half 6 then do 30min to 1hr cardio in the evenings, 4 days/wk. It is impossible to squeeze in some nutrients before I train in the morning so this is how I am doing it.
Pre workout + bcaa + glutamine,
Post workout 60g dextrose/Glucose + whey,
7:15 breakfast = 50-75g oats + 200gram egg whites,
10:30 100g basmati rice + 200gram chick,
13:30 lunch (last carbs of the day) 200g rice/ sweet pot etc + 200g x lean mince.
15:30 almonds + whey shake
19:00 250g veg + 200g red meat + 5g fish oils

Dieting down at the moment, been a month. Aim = 2600 - 2700 kcal (maintenance = 3150kcal)

Comment appreciated...

opt for cardio in the mornings and weight training in the evening

Yip, I agree that would be ideal but.... not an option.
thx

What I am more concerned about is carrying on with carbs too deep into the day.

I think that is pretty legit. Your carbs are taken when they are needed and in the evenings you have semi-fasted cardio. No need to change it up

First that's not 2700 calories. Take l-glutamine and bcaa intra with half the serving dextrose, sip on that during the workout. Just curious why can't you have whole food before weight training? The structure is also not good

you should have fast and slow digesting carbs before u train to be honest. this whole I can't have whole food before I train is a load of bullshit..u can wake up 30mins earlier to have some oats... if u want the results bad enough you will do it end of story... the only one holding u back from having the body you want is staring back at you in the mirror.

Thanks for the Replies guys,
@iman:
I have just given braod strokes as to my diet to give an idea of how my eating is structured. Yes if you calculate what i have put down you will not get to the total cal, but not the point of this. On my higher days I am hiting closer to 2800lcal, lower days closer to 2500kcal, but thats beside the point. Well observed though Currently I mix bcaa and glutamine with my pre workout, drink half as i wake up (4:20am) and sip the rest during. See Below...

@ DJ:
I hear you and agree 100%, used to do this when I was able to train in the evenings, and would eat 1 1/2 before and it was great. If i eat any closer to workout time, esp in the morning, .... lets just say I need to keep a bucket next to me on the squat rack.

DJ wrote: you should have fast and slow digesting carbs before u train to be honest. this whole I can't have whole food before I train is a load of bullshit..u can wake up 30mins earlier to have some oats... if u want the results bad enough you will do it end of story... the only one holding u back from having the body you want is staring back at you in the mirror.

awesome advice as always DJ. Another way I "cheat" for breakfast when i need to weight training early morning is mix 50g whey protein with 100g raw oats and 400ml water the night before. By morning, the oats has absorbed much of the whey and ill add another little water to this and chow down with around 30g of raisins as my pre workout meal. Fast and effective.

Before training this is what I eat: Oats + raisins + honey

@GSP: I've always wondered about mixing oats and whey. How does this taste and how is it possible to get down the oats while it's still raw?

Tastes fine, esp with a few raisins as GSP suggested. Some COCO powder works a treat to. Prefer blending though, easier to get down. The oats softens nicely.

Wimmas wrote: Before training this is what I eat: Oats + raisins + honey

@GSP: I've always wondered about mixing oats and whey. How does this taste and how is it possible to get down the oats while it's still raw?

Hey wimmas. Very much dependent on the whey protein powder you use imo. I use one whey protein and that is Evox 100% whey. When mixed with oats, its more than edible. In fact, i would rather drink 100g raw oats with whey protein as oppossed to eating 100g cooked oats. Also, if u are a bit concerned about mixing raw oats with water, i found substituing half water for half soy milk is not a bad idea as well.

Something I saved from an article written by John Kiefer of CBL. NOTE!! This is applicable to anyonem not just if you CBL!

THE PREMISE: Breakfast is the most important meal of the day. It will make you a healthy, happy, ripped, jacked, lean, energetic sex and training machine because it kickstarts your metabolism and gets your day off to the best possible start by providing the human rocket fuel called carbs.
THE OBSERVATION: All the shiny, happy fitness folks eat breakfast, so therefore, breakfast is the key to their success. This, of course, is backed up by all the anecdotal evidence and theoretical logic in the world. If you haven’t eaten anything all night, your body is starving and it’s going to need food, right? If you eat a lot of food in the morning, your metabolism turns on early in the day, and you’ll be able to burn off whatever you eat. And since your brain functions better with carbs, downing a low-fat, high-carb breakfast will make you smarter and help you function better at work and school.
THE REALITY: Whenever I start working with a new client, I tell them to stop eating breakfast. Breakfast sucks. You shouldn’t be eating it, either.
Here’s what happens with your hormones around 7 AM. Your cortisol levels elevate naturally through the night[1-9], eventually peaking[2, 9-14]. Of course, the common misperception is that cortisol is catabolic, and without food, your body will start to eat its own muscle. This is incorrect. When something is catabolic, this only describes the process of material being broken down for energy. When cortisol acts without elevated insulin levels—without being constantly elevated the way it is during chronic stress—it triggers the breakdown of triglycerides into free-fatty acids (FFAs) for metabolization, and triggers lipolysis[1, 2, 14-28]. In the morning, cortisol actually accelerates fat burning.
Your body’s main hunger control hormone is ghrelin[32]. It’s released in a pulsatile manner throughout the night, and it peaks when you wake[29-31]. This incites hunger, but ghrelin also potently stimulates the release of growth hormone[33-44]. As this happens, and growth hormone levels increase, your body releases more fat to be burned as fuel[45-49] and decreases the destruction of protein for use as fuel[50]. When you don’t eat carbs at breakfast (or more specifically, don’t spike insulin levels), your growth hormone levels peak approximately two hours after you wake up[51].
Your body starts each day as a fat-burning machine, and the key to simultaneous fat loss and muscle gain is to avoid screwing that up. Even when you’re exercising, your body will burn far higher levels of fat than normal on an empty stomach[52, 53]. This also causes the upregulation of enzymes crucial for burning fat, allowing fat to be metabolized faster[54].
Let’s say you eat a breakfast containing 30 grams or more of carbs. Your insulin levels raise with the rise in blood sugar, and this starts you on a downward spiral. This early-morning release of insulin vastly reduces fat burning for the remainder of the day[55], which is big problem because your morning cortisol levels remain high. As a result, this insulin release causes new empty fat cells to be created [56-64], and it lowers your levels of ghrelin and growth hormone[29-31, 51]. In other words, by eating breakfast, you’re essentially wreaking havoc on all the positive things that happen when you wake up.

And here we go... the can of worms....

THX
interesting article, not come across this before. Maybe I will look a little deeper.

Wimmas wrote: Before training this is what I eat: Oats + raisins + honey

@GSP: I've always wondered about mixing oats and whey. How does this taste and how is it possible to get down the oats while it's still raw?

I can't start my day without my oats and choc whey iso mixed with water. To me it tastes good. I started adding some raisins to it as well as of this morning (you suggested this in my thread) and now it tastes even better.

Safehouse wrote:

Wimmas wrote: Before training this is what I eat: Oats + raisins + honey

@GSP: I've always wondered about mixing oats and whey. How does this taste and how is it possible to get down the oats while it's still raw?

I can't start my day without my oats and choc whey iso mixed with water. To me it tastes good. I started adding some raisins to it as well as of this morning (you suggested this in my thread) and now it tastes even better.

as long as its your pre-workout meal the raisins are fine and a tasty edition. However, i wudnt be chowing on raisins for breakfast if I wasnt training within 45 minutes after i have eaten them

GSP wrote:

Safehouse wrote:

Wimmas wrote: Before training this is what I eat: Oats + raisins + honey

@GSP: I've always wondered about mixing oats and whey. How does this taste and how is it possible to get down the oats while it's still raw?

I can't start my day without my oats and choc whey iso mixed with water. To me it tastes good. I started adding some raisins to it as well as of this morning (you suggested this in my thread) and now it tastes even better.

as long as its your pre-workout meal the raisins are fine and a tasty edition. However, i wudnt be chowing on raisins for breakfast if I wasnt training within 45 minutes after i have eaten them

I've just spent the last couple of hours re-reading DJ's diet stickies and as before, you're spot on (I train evenings). I'll get it right soon.

It all depends on what kind of eating plan you are following. Your body will react differently to fasted training depending on how you structure your nutrient timing. Some of my best back and shoulder workouts this year have been lifting heavy completely fasted (around 12 hours without food) except for BCAAs and glutamine. No strength loss or endurance loss at all. But that is doing an intermittent fasting type of eating plan where fat loss was the primary goal. Lipolysis kickstarts into overdrive way easier once your system has adjusted to this, providing you with more than enough energy from breaking down fat to fatty acids.

If you are doing 6-8 small meals evenly spread throughout the day and then lift weights fasted first thing in the morning you won't have the same results and your workout will suffer, because your body is in a pattern to expect food constantly. Best to then do cardio in the mornings as suggested earlier.

What I have found to be working great for me, is to have my high carb days the day before my two heaviest training days ie legs & back. Then I am all power in the morning. Then I do med. carb on other training days and really low carb on non training days. More in line with carb cycling diet strategy.

Currently I am using Evox 5XL in the morning which is a pretty good mix between protein and carbs, basically 50/50. First time on this product though, so I am waiting before I comment on how well it works. Point I actually want to make is for you to maby buy a blender, I use to Take 75g oats and mix it with 8-10 raw egg yellows with maby 2 spoons of mile for taste. I however spoke to a nutritionest and she told me that your body absorbs less protein from raw eggs than from cooked eggs. Then I tried mixing oats with whey in the blender. Does not taste bad, if you blend it long enough the pieces are really small, you dont feel that badly bloated either doing it this way.

Egg whites, not yellows, sorry!

I once tried mixing oats with my whey. I use whey iso from basic supplements, it was still raw, but i drank it immediately after putting the oats in. Maybe I should leave it like 5 minutes or so? That would probably be the best I can imagine and the highlight of my day.

I get so sick and tired of eating the same shit everyday, but it's paying off. Always thought that only guys on gear get stretchmarks, but I'm now the proud owner of stretchmarks on my biceps, top triceps under my arms where they meet the lats and top sides of my chest, with no gear. Lol!

Wimmas wrote: I once tried mixing oats with my whey. I use whey iso from basic supplements, it was still raw, but i drank it immediately after putting the oats in. Maybe I should leave it like 5 minutes or so? That would probably be the best I can imagine and the highlight of my day.

I get so sick and tired of eating the same shit everyday, but it's paying off. Always thought that only guys on gear get stretchmarks, but I'm now the proud owner of stretchmarks on my biceps, top triceps under my arms where they meet the lats and top sides of my chest, with no gear. Lol!

If you leave it for 5 min+ the oats soften. Don't you mean "eat" as opposed to "drink" I don't add a lot of water - this makes the oats and whey mix into a paste like substance which I then eat.