Is Primobolan The Answer?

Howzit guys

I'd appreciate your views and opinions on this dilemma.

I've been using gear for a good few years now, like a little lab rat experimenting with different concoctions on myself. I've done a lot of test based cycles (Test enth + Eq) (Prop + Eq + Dbol) (Deca + Test enth) (Deca + Sus) and the results were always amazing. After lots of research I've even spent quite heavily on ideal PCT drugs to ensure my gains are secured. I've even tried incorporating letro during a cycle, and small doses of hcg as well per week, as suggested by other users. Nolva + Aroma + Hcg for PCT.

After a cycle, I maintain a good diet and continue to klap the gym, however I usually lose more than half my gains in no time. It becomes frustrating as I prefer to use gear once or twice a year at most, rather than cycling on and off the entire year.

This made me realize that I'd rather cycle with a compound that may not induce huge gains, but will ensure that the gains I make are kept once I'm off it. So far from my research, Primobolan seems to be that compound.

Here's some of the info on it:

Primobolan Depot (Methenolone Enanthate) had formerly enjoyed the status of being a cult favorite. In fact, it enjoyed the reputation of being Arnold’s favorite steroid - yes, that Arnold (and no, I don’t know where this rumor started). It was claimed by Bill Phillips - yes, that Bill Phillips, that whatever muscle you gain on Primobolan, you keep.

But now, whenever this compound is brought up in online steroid forums, I read the same comments: it’s too expensive, its overrated, I would rather use Masteron (drostanolone propionate), etc. And now, I find myself irritated, because when I try to explain the actual points that matter, the same comments are parroted at me. Personally, I find Primobolan to be an exemplary compound, and have had nothing but positive experiences with it.

Yes I do agree it can be quite pricey, but think about it, if it was quite pricey and no one purchased it, then the cost would go down. But this isn’t the case, and it is still widely used despite having one of the highest price tags in the black market attached to it.

The reason being, it works.

Though it may not have the explosion of Testosterone or the insomnia of Trenbolone, it still has its place.

primodex-100-primobolan-961Primo is part of the DHT family, and has a similar release time from the injection site into the bloodstream as a longer acting version of testosterone, namely Testosterone Enthate ( obviously they are both enthate esters ), and estrogen is never really an issue, even at high doses, or in gyno sensitive men. On the other side of that women have little to no issue taking Primobolan. Right down to the point, Primo is the safest steroid and pound for pound has the least amount of side effects, even at really high doses ( though not needed).

That all sounds great , but there are still the inpatient , quick fix users that are like, ya its weak that’s why it has no side effects. First I would like to point out that most of your gains made from Primo are permanent, if that’s not enough, usually the gains are lean, quality gains. So I may not yelp when I bench press, but I will keep my gains, how can you go wrong? Once again, that seems great, but some will still feel like it is not worth it because it does cause high blood pressure, or some other inconvenient side effect that some relate with muscle gain.

I think its best attribute is its effects on the other compounds stacked with it. Its unique quality overlap on to the other compounds. With Test, you see less water retention, and allows for better , cleaner gains. I have to state overall I retain more of my gains when Primo is involved, it caters the gains in the direction I want. In my opinion, no other steroid , besides Test, has a bigger effect on a cycle .

So lets look at the down side, its price. Lets be real, steroids are not cheap, and a good amount of money is spent to do a 12 week cycle. So when it comes to paying a little extra for Primo, it seems reasonable to me and I will tell you why. If I do a cycle of Test & Deca, and I spend $500, and I gain 25 pounds , but lose half when I come off. On the other hand, I could spend $700 for a cycle of Testosterone & Primobolan and gain 18 pounds and keep 17 of them, which would you prefer? These are actual stats from cycles of mine, not just random numbers, or un-repeat-able figures from some medical study.

When planning a good cycle it is NOT about how much you will gain, it is about how much you will keep.

Another


Ok, let's look at this drug. Methenolone is a DHT-based steroid (actually, DHB or dihydroboldenone, the 5-alpha reduced of the milder boldenon). Meaning when it interacts with the aromatase enzyme it does not form estrogens at all.(estrogen is what causes unwanted sides). But unlike deca you do not have to worry about progesterone problems (like bitch tits) either, so now you have the best of both worlds!

Since Primobolan does not convert to estrogen, it displays many favorable characteristics. Estrogen related side effects should not be seen at all when using this steroid. Sensitive individuals need not worry about developing gynecomastia, nor should they notice any water retention with this drug. The gains seen with Primobolan will be only quality muscle mass, and not the smooth bloat which accompanies most steroids open to aromatization. In addition, during a cycle, the user should not have much trouble with blood pressure values, as this effect is also related (generally) to estrogen and water retention - two common side effects that Primo just doesn't have.

You will hear Primo is weaker than deca. That's not exactly accurate. Deca is a great substance but is also very calorie dependant. Primo is not, primo can allow your diet to be a little loose. A few quotes by Bill Roberts: "It appears to cause less inhibition than Deca or testosterone for any given degree of anabolic effect, perhaps because of low CNS activity, lack of conversion to DHT, and lack of aromatization to estrogen." Do you understand what he is saying. Ok this is even true at a range of 600 mgs primo per week which is a highly effective dose. Requiring a little higher dosage to achieve the same anabolic effect, but since it is pleasant to use at doses considerably higher than what is pleasant for nandrolone esters (deca), it can achieve higher maximum effectiveness. In addition, Primobolan depot is attached to an ester which allows a half-life of about 5 to 10 days. This is a benefit to both the new or veteran user. Every day injections or every other day are a pain in the ass, no pun intended. But injecting Primo every 5 to 7 days is enough to allow for optimal blood levels.

Primobolan depot happens to have another plus, the drug is particularly excellent for use as the last injectable in a cycle, since for any given anabolic effect it gives much less inhibition of your natural testosterone production than other steroids such as testosterone, nandrolone, or tren. Therefore, residual levels of Primobolan can allow recovery of your natural test levels as you taper off your cycle while still offering useful anti-catabolic or even anabolic support.

And oh... When people blow up say 30lbs in a cycle its impossible to keep it all as most of it is water bloat. Even if you plan your cycle carefully and do your homework, half your gains, (if not more) will disappear within a few weeks. A slow quality builder like primo allows you to gain for the long term.

Often athletes find themselves falling for all the BS they hear in Internet chat rooms. Look, you have to talk to actual users! Real users with real experiences. Side effects with Primobolan Depot are minimal and manifest themselves only rarely and in persons who are extremely sensitive. Due to the androgenic residual effect, side effects can include light acne, deepening voice or increased hair growth. But who cares? Take B5 for the acne, women love deep voices, and increased hair growth? Cry me a river and shave.

Primobolan Depot has even less influence on the liver function than the oral Primo so that an increase of the liver's toxin values is extremely unlikely. The blood pressure, cholesterol level, HDL and LDL values, as with Primo tablets, usually remain unaffected. Primobolan Depot is generally the safest injectable steroid.

Like the tablets, Primobolan Depot has only a very small influence on the hypothalamuhypophysiat testicular axis so your body's own testosterone production is only reduced when very high dosages are taken over a prolonged period of time.


So my question is for the guys that use Primo. What are your experiences, and most importantly, have you kept most of your gains while on it? And how is the PGW Primo 200?

All thoughts and comments will be awesome.

Anything you gain with Primo you keep. It seems you have done quite a few complex cycles, so I would suggest around 800/1000mg of Primo a week.

Similar dose if you using the Aceta base.

I would also just include a maintenance dose of test a week, eg: 1 shot of Sustanon or something similar.

Thanks Pump..

Have you tried the Pgw Primo 200? Pgw stuff has always been top notch in my experience, but haven't tried the primo.

Yes I have.. Love it.. It's like mothers milk.. I know it can get quite pricey but you will achieve better results with that over hGH.

In the next 2 months, I will be going on a 6 month course of Primo, but lower dose, 600mg a week, I don't want to aggravate any potential side effects that can come about.

I am still playing my options LP Primo Acetate for 12 weeks, or PGW Primo Enanthate... I have just finished a short course of LP Anavar and threw in some Turinabol at 80mg a day, seems to work quite nicely.. But they both 17 Alkyl steroid, so didn't want to stay on them for to long, I could feel my liver starting to take a hammering near the end.

If you going to use the Acetate I wouldn't even recommend using Test, you can just use Proviron with it, then you get 1 less potential side effect, well if you do, then rather use Prop with it.

Was definitely thinking of going with the enanthate primo, and perhaps nandro prop and anavar as an oral. I'll probably run proviron as well if using nandro.

But I'm also leaning towards running a 15 - 20 week primo only cycle at 600-800mgs pw, similar to yourself. Since Primo is about half as suppressive as test, a longer cycle isn't an issue.

I'm just not certain about PCT for Primo. Since it does not aromatise to estrogen, will I still need to use anti-e's like Letro or Aroma and Nolva for PCT? Or would HCG alone be suitable?

What sort of PCT on Primo has worked for you boet?

I wouldn't add in nandro.. keep the cycle simple, use Test at 250mg a week, use Primo at 600/800mg a week, then use Anavar from the last day you pin the Primo for 6 weeks afterwards, then only go into PCT. The anavar is just to ride out the long ester of Primo and then go into a recovery without losing any gains (yes primo you don't lose gains) but your body running with a low natural test supply can make you slip into a very catabolic state. So the above structured layout will work very nicely in making sure you keep your strength right into PCT. Just note the Anavar will probably suppress your appetite in a big way, but not to worry, even if you do land up eating less food, I find with anavar I am able to sustain strength and lean mass on a calorie reduced diet. I would also stop the test the same time you stop the Primo and include Proviron for those 6 weeks.

An Anti-E works differently in the body when androgens are higher or lower. So using it during the cycle wouldn't be necessary, and Primo should be strong enough to combat any estrogen side effects from that low dose of test. However your PCT must consist of hCG + Nolva.

You can use the hCG during the 6 weeks on the var, as it's slightly suppressive so you will be able to recovery to a degree with the hCG (stop the day you start the nolva) and then just use Nolva at 20mg for 30 days for your PCT.

That is how I would structure it anyway.

Sounds good Pump, thanks for the guidance. I sincerely appreciate it.

So the key would be to definitely include test in the cycle? Would running the Test along with the Primo for 15-20 weeks be a bit taxing on the body or should I resort to keeping the cycle at 12 weeks?

I guess running Prop with Primo isn't going to make much sense, as I'd need to inject Prop EOD and Primo 300mg twice a week. So perhaps Test Enanthate with the same half life as Primo will be a better option?

Test E / Cyp or Test Combo by PGW and their Primo, once a week shots is sufficient, unless you want to split it, but you not going to find any further stability by injecting it twice a week.

At a dose of 250mg a week (their test cyp) you can comfortably run it for 15/20+ weeks. However, primo is not nearly as forgiving as other steroids, you need to make sure you are strict with training, not abusing your body, eating and most importantly rest.

You will achieve mild blowing results, the reason why people don't achieve good results with Primo is because they don't put the effort into their cycle as they should, also they run to low doses.

You making me excited, maybe i should go straight from PCT to my Primo, hehe.. kidding, my body needs a 6 week break at least before I go into any long term cycles..

I'm just as keen as you are bud.

Thanks for all the tips and advice. I read somewhere that Primo is very protein intake dependent to notice significant gains. Going to seriously up on the grilled chicken.

If I can keep 5/6Kg after the PCT, then I'll be a happy man indeed.

Thanks again boet.

i am thinking of doing a very similar thing but with var!
running a maintenance test at 300mg enth a week for 12 weeks, and 80mg var a day for the last 8 weeks(bit if a stretch i know but i dont drink so liver should cope)if anyone has run var at that kind of dose for longer and had bloodwork feedback wouild be awesome!

That dose for that period of time is perfect. Forget blood tests, often they don't pick up how damaged my body really is until it's gone to far. You are more than welcome to switch to Primo Acetate and you will be able to run that for 12 weeks.

what kind of dose of the oral acetate does one need to run a day?

An effective dose would be 80/100mg a day. This you can use for prolong periods of time.

pump im thinking of doing a 12-14 week primo only with just proviron...good or bad idea?
acetate or enanthate?(does it make a difference)

Yes, it does.. For that length period I would use the E, however use the Ace for the first 2 weeks and use it again in the last 2 weeks of the cycle, then go straight to PCT.

What I mean, is start with E but use Ace with it for 2 weeks.

1.ok and how long after last shot do i start PCT? will the proviron be enough to keep me from shutdown or should HCG be used in PCT?

2.would a cycle like this be superior to a anavar only cycle?

thanx for all the advice,i learn alot from you

Yes this cycle beats Anavar hands down due to no nasty side effects, no chances of gyno, very giving on your HPTA, etc.

The Proviron will shut you down a little too, you can if you feel you need it add, hCG half way through the cycle, 250iu, EOD or every 3rd of 4th day, will also work.

If you use the Ace for the last 2 weeks then you can go straight into PCT a day or two afterwards.

wow! does primo make var look cheap! LOL
think i will be sticking with the Var

hmm, not that much more expensive. and you pay for what you get. if you want a drug that has the least possible side effects, then primo is for you

00pump is there a way to convert T-testosterone levels in nmol/L to mg per wek or per day?

had bloodwork done yesterday...also wil the fact that i had just under 5 hours sleep, took 120mcg of clen at 6:30am and i had the bloods done at 4:00pm effect the test results?

have got Total-Test, FSH and LH.

Are you trying to ask what ones usual, normal range for serum testosterone levels? And you asking if that is x nmol/L what is thay value converted to mg of total testosterone per week?

yes, to get an ideal of what my natural test level is like in comparison to the amount of endogenous test one would use in a cycle...

also would those environment factors have a effect on my result, i am not happy with them lol. oh and i moered a facet joint in my spine on monday too fml, walking has been painfull! and training wont be resumed soon FML dont know if that will cause a cortisol blact etcetc or what.

i got a T-Test of 13.74 nmol/L and if i am correct that converts too 395.965 (ng or mg?)/dL

FSH was 1.8 iu/L
LH was 3.8 iu/L

The sum is multiply by 28.843 or devide by 0.0347 so 396.303ng rounded off