Dianabol and collagen synthesis

Does anyone have any decent info on the collagen synthesis rate of dianabol. Since dianabol is virtually identical in structure to boldenone, which increases collagen synthesis by over 300%, I would think dianabol has similar properties. But I can't find any hard and fast info on this.

Ive searched f*cked up and i cannot find anything relating with dbol and collagen synthesis. maybe there shud be a study done coz i dont think anyone has done it yet.

SNOK1986 wrote:

Ive searched f*cked up and i cannot find anything relating with dbol and collagen synthesis. maybe there shud be a study done coz i dont think anyone has done it yet.

Thanks Snok, I also can't find anything. Want to run tren on next cycle, but have been having some problems with my elbows. Since this is going to be a 6 weeker, don't really want to run EQ, otherwise I'll have to frontload at some heavy doses. Can't run NPP as two nortests is asking for shit.
So I was thinking if dbol has similar properties to EQ, since they are almost identical in structure, would it also have similar collagen synthesis properties.

No prob, i dont see why not dbol will not have the same effect as equi since equi was a stuff up dbol experiment that turned into equi.
Im also interested in it, ill ask around

OOOf tren, gives me the shivers everytime i say or think it. Some strong stuff that its gonna make u kak strong and ur elbows arnt doing well i can see ur predicament here and its a kak one... but im sure there is an explanation somewhere.

SNOK1986 wrote:

No prob, i dont see why not dbol will not have the same effect as equi since equi was a stuff up dbol experiment that turned into equi.
Im also interested in it, ill ask around

OOOf tren, gives me the shivers everytime i say or think it. Some strong stuff that its gonna make u kak strong and ur elbows arnt doing well i can see ur predicament here and its a kak one... but im sure there is an explanation somewhere.

Thanks bro, also nervous on the tren-popping my cherry on the tren, and you hear so many stories

Ok ive asked on a few other sites and ive gotten this ....... nothing no one wants to reply or they cant coz they actually dont knw... hahaha i think u have hit a good one here Yoh.

Yohimbe wrote:

"Can't run NPP as two nortests is asking for shit."

What do you mean by that?

Andre511 wrote:

Yohimbe wrote:

"Can't run NPP as two nortests is asking for shit."

What do you mean by that?

Both tren and NPP are nor testosterones and convert to progestins which have a high binding affinity for the progesterone receptor. Added to that NPP converts to estrogen, albeit at a far lower rate than test, but non the less.
Add test in the mix and you have a recipe for progesterone, estrogen and prolactin gyno all in one. Never a good idea to run two nor tests at the same time.

SNOK1986 wrote:

Ok ive asked on a few other sites and ive gotten this ....... nothing no one wants to reply or they cant coz they actually dont knw... hahaha i think u have hit a good one here Yoh.

I get the same shit. Where the hell is Inja when you need him

WAHAHAHAHAHAHHA he is probably studying it right now so he can tell us. LOL!

SNOK1986 wrote:

WAHAHAHAHAHAHHA he is probably studying it right now so he can tell us. LOL!

If you make a spelling mistake he's all over you like a fat chick on a cup cake, but now he ignores

BWAHAHAHAHAH true true

He will make an entrance soon... Its building up i can feel it...entrance of a life time.

The same feeling as when the latest rambo movie came out :laugh:

I know the feeling...
I've been waiting for Inja and Admin to creep up on my thread...

SNOK1986 wrote:

BWAHAHAHAHAH true true

He will make an entrance soon... Its building up i can feel it...entrance of a life time.

The same feeling as when the latest rambo movie came out :laugh:

(File Removed)

Beesting and Inja collaboration, how sweet

No dice, karma still pending....

Inja wrote:

SNOK1986 wrote:

BWAHAHAHAHAH true true

He will make an entrance soon... Its building up i can feel it...entrance of a life time.

The same feeling as when the latest rambo movie came out :laugh:

(File Removed)

WHAHAHAHAHA that is an entrance :laugh:

No karma yet till u tell us what is what with this topic.

Hmmm... Struggling with this one since I've never really given it a look before.

Thing isit seems like there is a lot of crap on bodybuilding websites that doesn't quite match up with the factual stuff.

All steroids increase collagen synthesis, by increased nitrogen retention and protein synthesis. Collagen afterall is protein too. The compounds often tauted on websites for collagen synthesis are EQ, Anavar, Deca and Primo. All of these are not very androgenic but very anabolic, and don't aromatise to any great degree. So there might be something there. Dbol you will appreciate will aromatise heavily.

While androgens seem to send collagen building signals estrogens seems to weaken joint collagen. So too much estrogen may not be brilliant for joints, but at the same time we all know that we need some estrogen for anti-inflammatory responses and cushioned joints. Certainly when using non-aromatisable adrogens joint become stiff and sore.

So, all in all if you go by the compounds normally recommended on forums for collagen synthesis then Dbol is not the best choice because it is more androgenic and estorgenic. At the same time however it will increase collagen synthesis none the less and slight bloat will help to cushion joints (raised estrogen).

Sorry not much help on this one but most of this is stuff I just read now. I'll try and do more reading to see if I can clarify anything further... Never really bothered with the topic before.

P.S. Using any anabolic causes increases in strength which will result in more strain being put on your elbow. You really need to watch the weight if you want to look after that elbow Yohimbinoid.

:clapclap


Now please answer my question about lipotropic injections :bow

N3rd said:

Now please answer my question about lipotropic injections

Good night

I don't even have the energy to tell BradA he's a jackass for not researching how to do gear properly and construct a PCT before jumping head first into his first cycle with Dbol Anadrola Winnie and Test over on the other thread, but he's a jackass none the less.

When I awaken tomorrow I'll find your thread and give it a bash but I have a feeling it'll be some typing. Did you find all the ingredients and concentrations in the product? I don't remember...

Lol :laugh:
Yeah, saw it...
Poor guy seem s frigntened.

Ok, no prob, I understand....
The product that I found (hopefully the right one) has concentrations and ingredients.

Inja wrote:

Hmmm... Struggling with this one since I've never really given it a look before.

Thing isit seems like there is a lot of crap on bodybuilding websites that doesn't quite match up with the factual stuff.

All steroids increase collagen synthesis, by increased nitrogen retention and protein synthesis. Collagen afterall is protein too. The compounds often tauted on websites for collagen synthesis are EQ, Anavar, Deca and Primo. All of these are not very androgenic but very anabolic, and don't aromatise to any great degree. So there might be something there. Dbol you will appreciate will aromatise heavily.

While androgens seem to send collagen building signals estrogens seems to weaken joint collagen. So too much estrogen may not be brilliant for joints, but at the same time we all know that we need some estrogen for anti-inflammatory responses and cushioned joints. Certainly when using non-aromatisable adrogens joint become stiff and sore.

So, all in all if you go by the compounds normally recommended on forums for collagen synthesis then Dbol is not the best choice because it is more androgenic and estorgenic. At the same time however it will increase collagen synthesis none the less and slight bloat will help to cushion joints (raised estrogen).

Sorry not much help on this one but most of this is stuff I just read now. I'll try and do more reading to see if I can clarify anything further... Never really bothered with the topic before.

P.S. Using any anabolic causes increases in strength which will result in more strain being put on your elbow. You really need to watch the weight if you want to look after that elbow Yohimbinoid.

Thanks Inja-I've countered some of juiced bad karma, for now anyway

Also little concerned with the elbow-it's not bad, but its there and tren makes you notoriously stronger and also being a strong androgen will dry me out a bit so could spell trouble.
Maybe I'll just do a NPP and test cycle for now and try get the joints feeling good. But damn I want to pop my tren cherry.

Hows your leg BTW?

Inja is wrong im afraid,not all steroids increase collagen synthesis,Test actually breaks down collagen production by 80%.
To counter-act this effect,a person could just use an OTC collagen supplement or something called JointEZE or Arthroguard.No need for Dbols.

tiny wrote:

Inja is wrong im afraid,not all steroids increase collagen synthesis,Test actually breaks down collagen production by 80%.
To counter-act this effect,a person could just use an OTC collagen supplement or something called JointEZE or Arthroguard.No need for Dbols.

Not actually bro.
I realise alot of steroid boards say that, but its really hogwash, its all in the context of how your looking at it. All anabolic steroids increase collagen synthesis.

Inja wrote:

tiny wrote:

Inja is wrong im afraid,not all steroids increase collagen synthesis,Test actually breaks down collagen production by 80%.
To counter-act this effect,a person could just use an OTC collagen supplement or something called JointEZE or Arthroguard.No need for Dbols.

Not actually bro.
I realise alot of steroid boards say that, but its really hogwash, its all in the context of how your looking at it. All anabolic steroids increase collagen synthesis.

Lets agree to disagree then.If AAS are so good for collagen synthesis,then why do so many guys end up with ligament and and joint injuries while on juice.Obviously some drugs help and others dont.Ill appreciate if you could shed more light on your theory.

Taken from another forum:

"While injecting test increases protein synthesis by roughly 50 times, depending on dose and time, most bodybuilders forget that it will reduce collagen synthesis by more than 50% -- more like 80%, giving you the collagen synthesis rate of a senior citizen. Since collagen makes up tendons, bros are very prone to injury if they continue to lift very heavy, unless they cycle off T and let their collagen synthesis get back to normal. It's like having the skeletal muscle of a gorilla with the tendons of a very old man.

Winstrol increases collagen synthesis. It will give you bigger tendons. However, your body compensates for this by making them more brittle, weaker, and more prone to injury. I can't tell you how many bros work out anaerobically and become injured while on winstrol. Guys who lift in the 1-5 rep range while on winstrol, to baseball players who sprint all out from a stationary position -- winstrol should be the LAST drug they choose. Most of them like winstrol because they don't get the weight gain from it but it is very detrimental to bros who train for any sport anaerobically. Tendons tear easily on it.

Also, the drugs I mention increase collagen synthesis while also increasing collagen cross-linking integrity, making for a much stronger tendon.

Winstrol, on the other hand, will dramatically increase collagen syn, but ironically it decreases collagen cross-linking integrity, thus making a much weaker tendon.

You can plan a cycle of AAS which will increase collagen synthesis and skeletal muscle growth at the same time. The key is the drug(s) you choose.

Deca, Equipoise, Anavar, and Primobolan will ALL increase skeletal muscle while at the same time dramatically increase collagen syn and bone mass and density, leaving you with a substantially reduced chance of becoming injured than if you choose to use AAS like sus, cyp, or enth.

While testosterone will increase bone mass and density, even at supra-physiological levels, the result is weaker tendons due to inhibition of collagen syn.

To plan a cycle where the goal is to increase skeletal muscle mass/strength while at the same time increase joint/tendon/ligament strength, enough to keep up with the dramatic increase in skeletal muscle, you must choose drugs like Eq, Deca, Anavar, or Primo as the base of your cycle. Testosterone and its esters can be added to your cycle to keep levels within a 'normal' physiological range (ie, 100-200 mg/wk) but must not go above this. Since drugs like eq, deca, anavar and primo will reduce endogenous, natural levels of test, these levels may be maintained with exogenous test in the 100-200 mg/wk range. Test at this dose will not inhibit collagen syn, but paradoxically, will help increase it. It is when exogenous testosterone is used > 200 mg/wk that collagen syn is inhibited.

Deca @ 3 mg/kg a week(about 270 mg/wk for a 200 lb male) will increase procollagen III levels by 270% by week 2. Procollagen III is a primary indicator used to determine the rate of collagen syn. As you can see, deca is a very good drug at giving you everything you want -- an increase in collagen syn, an increase in skeletal muscle, and increases in bone mass and density. The one thing it does not give you is wood.

Primobolan, @ 5 mg/kg, will increase collagen synthesis by roughly 180% -- less than deca and equipoise but still substantial.

Equipoise @ 3 mg/kg will increase procollagen III by approximately 340% -- slightly better than deca.

Oxandrolone has over a hundred studies documenting its effectiveness at treating patients needing rapid increases in collagen syn to enhance healing.

These drugs have longer half-lives than most other AAS, so this should be considered when timing your post cycle Clomid use. Here they are:

Deca: 15 days Equipoise: 14 days Primobolan: 10.5 days

Anavar has a half-life of only 8 hours so it should not pose a problem.

GH is probably the most remarkable drug at increasing collagen synthesis. It increases collagen syn in a dose dependant manner -- the more you use, the more you will increase collagen syn. It has also demonstrated this ability in short and long term studies. From what I've read, hGH at 6 iu/day increased the collagen deposition rate by around 250% in damaged collagen structures. This result indicates that the increased biomechanical strength of wounds to collagen structures treated with biosynthetic human growth hormone was produced by an increased deposition of collagen in the collagen structures.

Eq, primo, anavar, and deca are all good -- they increase several biomakers of collagen syn -- ie, type III, II, I, procollagen markers. GH just seems to do so most dramatically.

Use of any of these drugs @ supra-physiological levels with a maintenance dose of test will increase collagen syn while at the same time increase skeletal muscle mass. Skeletal muscle mass gains will not be as dramatic as with large testosterone doses but you have to weigh the risk/reward basis for yourself. Also, these drugs do not satisfy the libido like testosterone, but that is not the point of this thread. It is only to demonstrate that you can increase skeletal muscle and collagen syn at the same time with certain AAS -- the decision is up to you."

Yeah, I read that already, but if you put it in context its not really that simple and makes that hogwash. All steroids increase collagen synthesis. Like I said before the increased injury on AAS is for the most attributed to massive strength gains on cycle and drying out the joints as a sacrifice to look hard and ripped. I'll still try and find more on the matter.